Special Editions

The post from Mr. Kern got me thinking about special edition IWC watches. From time to time we learn about special edition watches on this forum, but usually after they have been assigned or allocated to a particular retailer or organization.
In some cases, questions are posed here or on other forums requesting moderator input as to the authenticity, price and availability of these watches.
Sometimes, even the moderators are unaware of these special editions until they do a little research.
For example, I own one of the "Carlson" doppels which I learned about through this forum. I had to buy one on the secondary market after making inquiry to several parties.
My question is this. Is there any way for this forum to document the special edition watches so our members are educated as early as possible on their existence, availability and price?

I've been discussing your question....

..with Schaffhausen. Everyone agrees that this forum should have information available early on, but the logistics aren't simple.

The problems include:

a) generally the "right" to announce first a special edition understandably is given the party who is involved with that edition (a retailer, a distributor in a given country, the named person, etc.).

b) often there are formal debuts, such as gathering of retailers, a press event, etc.

c) sometimes those dates are changed --either accelerated or postponed, and sometimes at the last minute.

So, even when I receive some product information with a suggested date, I can't then announce anything on this forum. And often a friendly retailer "leaks" the information to a different collector or website and we're not always first here.

If there were 2 or 3 special editions I could follow them very carefully and get reports which would narrow any timing gaps. But there are proably 40 editions, considering all variations, and it's a logistical nightmare. There's no one person at IWC whose job is to report regularly all release dates to me, and it's a difficult thing to ask.

Bright suggestions here are welcome.

Regards,
Michael

A logistical problem, nightmare? No, I think

First of all, I would suggest that it is not absolutely necessary to have the information about limited edition watches on the forum at the earliest possible moment, just after the owner of the limited edition watches has announced them.

Secondly, I think it is safe to say that our moderators are to be trusted absolutely with secret information, I guess they proved that abundantly in the last few years.

This gives the possibility to use the succesful concept of loosely coupled systems, presented in a special disguise. But to be succesful it presumes that at IWC Schaffhausen there is at least one person that knows everything about the limited edition watches that are going to appear.

With all this in mind, it is relatively easy. As soon as presentable information about limited edition watches is availble in Schaffhausen, the moderators of the forum get this information, that they are not going to disclose until the moment is there. It may be difficult to predict that moment, but it will be really clear that moment is there when information comes out, from other sources like mentioned by Michael. At that moment the moderators reveal the information they got earlier on on the forum, and everybody is happy. I am quite sure that the forum members get the information soon enough to be able to order a watch in time, most of the time: you can't win them all.

Why not give this a try?

Kind regards,
Paul, wearing Saint Exupéry Chrono

OK by me

Ok by me Paul I agree with you

                        Regards
                         Argiris

procedurally it's a little different...

Dear Paul,

With respect, you may underestimate what's involved.

I have received the proprietary information in advance. In prior years, I received early on a confidential booklet that had all special editions in it. I haven't received anything for 2008 yet, other than for a few "large" special editions.

However, during the course of the year there were many changes (new editions and some never made it. Moreover, details changed --edition sizes, engravings, and certainly anticipated debut dates). Moreover, some models were diverted and sold through different channels or markets than originally planned. Also, the images I receive initially are generally not of reproduction quality. It's not good to start off a model with a bad photo or drawing.

It's also not terrific to public incorrect information. So even if the issue is not needing to be "absolute first", I need to hear, model by model, week by week, when a special edition will debut and each of its characteristics. If you take numerous product details and mutliply it by a lot of models, and than add in changes, it's labor intensive. Each model needs to be re-reported to me almost in its entirelty, plus additional details (images, etc.) when or shortly after it goes to market. Someone can do that, of course, but it does require a lot of "manual" time.

Regards,
Michael

Why are nice things seldom easy?

Hi Michael,

Thank you very much for your explanation. Watches interest me a lot, but also models, marketing and logistics about them. The sum of all these aspects make watches so fascinating to me.

So, there is more than meets my eye, I should have known, given that it is in everybody's interest to have this kind of information available to a group of people that is so interested as the forum members: if it were easy it would have been here a long time already.

I like to think in models, knowing that the devil is in the detail. But the right model gives you a view of a possible feasibility that has to be acknowledged by the details. So my model was wrong, if you want to solve this problem you have to find the right model. If the problem lies in all those changes that occur all the time, it really is a waste of time to start there. Maybe one should start at the end: the owner of the limited edition watches. Can't he be seduced to reveal the necessary information at the moment of his liking, in exchange for a free high quality marketing channel, called the IWC collectors forum?

I guess there is a catch here too, but if somebody, or a group, thinks long and hard enough about it, a solution may come, if it is really wanted. I am looking forward to that solution.

Kind regards,
Paul, wearing Saint Exupéry Chrono

You are probably right Michael

So what do you think it should be done Michael? You are right, I was part wrong. It is a hard job but someone has to do it. I ll try to come up with something and let you know.
Thanks for the analysis of this issue.

                                                        Regards
                                                          Argiris

Send me one of each and I will do the report :-)

Somebody has to make sacrifices, isn't it? I do need to test them extensively too so I am not sure if and when I would send them back ;-)

Just kidding of course. 40 models per year means one almost every week and probably there are 'busy' periods. This would be too much work for our moderators I think.

The idea of Paul about the free publicity sounds good but most limited editions will probably be sold out quickly even without the added publicity.

Kind regards,

Clemens

to me it's the Achilles' heel of the Internet....

Hi Paul,

I spend a lot of time thinking through how this forum and IWC can better communicate through the Internet. Early on, I was convinced that the Internet was the wave of the future.

I still think it is, but only in the sense that it can reach a lot of people more quickly and with more dialog (forum or not) than other media. What I find frustrating is that it still requires manual input in and often any input back needs to be processed manually. There's nothing wrong with that ---but it terribly slows down the process. It creates a huge bottleneck before and another one after.

The problem with your suggestion about the "owner" of the limited edition watches (I assume you mean the dealer, etc. who is involved with the model) is the input. Someone needs to go from owner to owner, and convince them of the value of publicity here. A large task and not always one that will be achieved in each instance.

But, really, inches by inches --I am working on getting more information accessible here. On the whole, I think we do the best, but need to work on special editions a bit more.

Regards,
Michael

hi Michael,

thanks a lot for all your comments. It's a very good read and I like your idea's on the internet. I must say that I think it's not a good idea to have all limiteds here first on the forum. I think that part of the fun is that forum members read see in out and find new models....and share rather than getting a list presented.. I can remember seeing a iwc gl in Italy... There was at that time one post that there might be a Italie limited and here I it was! I bought the watch and shared the story on line... Isn't it part of the fun not knowing everything? Thanks Michael ... for your endless work here at the forum! Greetings Martijn

There has to be a way...

of getting accurate info from IWC. I am not sure that the retailers of special editions are looking for publicity. It appears that most special editions are sold out almost immediately. However, someone at IWC has to know what the plan is in any given time period. Even if it is after the fact, accurate info transmitted through the moderator would be better than what we have now.
There must be a way to provide this info to our members in an accurate manner.

we do have extensive coverage here...

...I would guess that 95% of special editions are reported here within 30 days of their debut. There clearly is more coverage here than anywhere else in the world. It is a large task, including of my time which candidly is not unlimited.

I note that you first posted about 6 months ago, so you may not have followed all special edition coverage. Also, for those in Asia there is a lot of coverage elsewhere on special editions, especially for Sincere. Sincere has close relationships with some of their local customers, so they often get the news first. But candidly those special editions (and the Carlson one) represent, I would estimate, a miniscule percentage (probably not 5%) of IWC special edition production, and their role is over-emphasized, notwithstanding that they are often nice watches.

If you have specific, cost-effective and constructive procedural suggestions, please feel free to drop me an E-mail. As I said before, suggestions are welcome.

Thanks,
Michael

A great post and string

My suggestion would be first for us to understand what we (typical forum members) would like to know, exactly, about Special Editions. (Putting our trousers on before our shoes is normally a good strategy). Then maybe some form of data mining followed by knowledge sharing options could be considered to emphasise efficiency.

Does speculation help us ? For some this is very exciting and for others perhaps not ? For example, some suggestions in the German forum indicate a number of 2008 special editions for Asia - but at this time point it is only speculation (as MF eludes to earlier - does this help us to know of things that wont actually leave Schaffhausen). I (with two other collectors) also learned that there will be a (very) special edition of the Vintage Collection-Jubilee Edition 1868-2008 (appearing in Asia in gold). Very exciting for some I presume - but will it really happen is a different topic altogether. It also polarises the thoughts about the steel and platinum versions currently announced - which in some eyes creates a dilemna of (potential) choice.

From a curator, archive and IWC fan viewpoint I would be more interested to have a source of all special editions that have currently been produced with details about the "special characteristics" as 1st priority. Does this already exist ?

I also had a similar line of thought about "Boutique exclusive" editions. En route to the SIHH the Geneva boutique had some great non-catalogue pieces that were stunning.

Andrew