The CF3 inside

Tilo,
It's a hypothetical question. Would you pay more for a more decorated movement on a closed back watch? I would not.

Alan, I suppose you (and me and anybody else) already do, if you get it or not. Only a (smaller) part of the retail price is production cost. But I again believe, my new Silberpfeil will have the decoration as one might assume seeing the decorated movement directly under the watch on the Silberpfeil page of the Collection.
www.iwc.com/en/collection/ingenieur/IW3785SI/


That's all I want and expect. :-)
Is it too much?

Tilo,
You are missing my point. I can think of independent watchmakers who charge tens of thousands of dollars for the extra fine finishing. Some collectors value this level of decoration and precision and are willing to pay for it. I understand that.
But back to my original question...If you were given the choice to spend an additional amount for additional finishing on a closed back watch would you do it?

I think lack of decoration should not necessarily be taken as indication of poor finishing. To my understanding, finishing of edges and surfaces affects the performance, durability and longevity of the movement. Decoration is purely for aesthetic purposes. It's evident that this movement is not decorated but I'm not sure if any of us in this discussion is able to judge the finishing. I certainly am not but I'm willing to trust IWC that it is well finished.

Whether decoration is important on a closed back watch is of course a matter of personal preference. I do agree with Alan, though, that it comes with a cost. A cost that has to be added to the price, saved on other features or taken out of IWC's profit margin.

Thomas

There is a famous story about Steve Jobs, shouting at his engineers at Apple because the internal design of a particular Mac was looking ugly. They said: "as a user, you will never see the inside, so why does it hurt you?" And he replied: "Because I know."

I think this is exactly how an owner of this watch must feel like.

Answering Alan's question, put here again: if there are two almost identical watches, the only difference being that the one has a beautifully decorated movement, the other having the same movement finished like on the Spitfire Chrono, the former being $2000 more expensive, I would take the latter. I don't care that much for purely ornamental finishing.

If there are two almost identical watches, the only difference being that the one has a beautiful bracelet with a micro adjustment feature, the other having a leather strap, the former being $2000 more expensive, I would take the former. For that price it probably would be a super bracelet, it coming new on the watch and later adding a strap is the better way to do than the other way round.

Now, a bit more realistically, change that $2000 into $1000, in both cases I again would make the same choice.

Kind regards,
Paul

Adam, methinks you nailed this one squarely on the head!

I think the question is not if I would want to pay more:

• you WILL get a decent decorated manufacture movement at other brands at this price point. So bottom line is that IWC asks more for less
• IWC is selling luxury and haute horlogerie across the board (to justify high prices): this is not coherent
• we are all fans of mechanical watches, for me the love for the mechanics includes basic decorations(we have seen movement finishing increase over the last years for most brands).

IWC, in my knowledge, always decorated their movements, why stop now?

Rubbish. I will be an owner of this watch and I could not care less if the movement is not decorative. To me it looks great. Solid. I'm very happy. At least I will be when I pick it up. It's a non issue.

Wau, regardless of the discussed topic, I allow myself to say that this is quite an offensive language on the forum...
I hope that I speak on behalf of many...

I hope not. I disagree which I am entitled to do. And in NZ at least, the word "rubbish" is quite an inoffensive way to disagree with someone. If it is too offensive I'm sure it will be deleted but I really don't think so. In fact I think it is a very tame word and not meant in an aggressive way.

Cheers,

Jarrod

Maybe, but it's not rubbish. It just happens to be a viewpoint different from yours and expressed by someone you don't like. Frankly, Jobs' statement was Bible to most Swiss watchmakers before anyone thought to put a crystal on a caseback.

It is rubbish. To say that everyone who has bought the watch must feel this way, is, rubbish. I have, and I don't. So it is rubbish. In my opinion. And again, in NZ that word is just about the least offensive word you can use so I do apologise if it causes offence.

And just another correction, I don't dislike Regulateur! I have never met him, he may well be a fine man. But I don't agree with what he said. That's all.

Cheers,

Jarrod

I think Regulateur is having quite a lot of fun here, heating up the atmosphere a bit. But he is dead wrong with his comparison of an unfinished piece of plastic with the well finished movement of the Spitfire Chrono. I guess this movement looks as good if not better than any part of an Apple device. In fact, Steve Jobs might have liked this movement, having no unnecessary frills, just like Apple devices.

Kind regards,
Paul

This is precisely the point I was trying to make. Thanks for your added insight.

The reality is, these watches are a novelty ... If I wanted a tool watch, I would buy a g-shock.. I expect for 5 figures a movement on the inside that doesn't look like a hack knock off.. Look at the pathetic engraving of the lettering.. I expect precision and over engineering on these novelties.. It's why we spend the money...

Adam, you mentioned Rolex... I would argue no Rolex movement looks anywhere as pathetic as this .. As plain as the Rolex movements are, they are still decorated to some extent and the lettering is sharp, in gold, with perlage..

I couldn't have put it better - thank you.

And: We are speaking about luxury goods here, so it is hilarious to talk about production costs. They have nothing to do with the list price.

Good for Rolex. With respect to IWC, I have no problem with the movement at hand, which looks perfectly fine to my eyes. I've seen what a truly unfinished movement looks like, and this simply ain't it.

Trust me, I more than understand the impulse to pile on with righteous indignation and rake IWC over the coals here, but I've been in the game long enough to recognize a non-starter when I see one. The caliber 89000 family of chronographs are rightly lauded for their performance and features, and a couple of Geneva stripes won't change this one way or another.

Some will refuse to let go, decrying the brand for selling them a hollow dream, which is their right, but I'll be too busy admiring the dial while timing my son's laps in the pool(and anything else I can think of) to care. The CF3 is destined to be remembered as a classic, movement and all.

Regards,
Adam